Comments on: Think the Naginata has a long-range kick? http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/ News and thoughts about my adventures in Second Life, Combat: Samurai Island, and Virtual Worlds Sat, 11 Oct 2008 02:19:21 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v= By: Shindo http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1281 Shindo Sun, 04 May 2008 16:25:02 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1281 OMGosh! You don't come to a site for a bit and bam! A whole bunch of dtuff happens. lol I think the reason that you are not getting consistant numbers is because, that the ones testing it use different ways to measure distance. If we all had the same tools, then I think that you'd have your consistant results. With that said, we realize that you are all busy. There are people that try to help out as much as possible. A friend and I are going to make tools to try and test weapons. Maybe then tests from us may be more helpful. With that said: Let my army grooooooow! lol OMGosh! You don’t come to a site for a bit and bam! A whole bunch of dtuff happens. lol I think the reason that you are not getting consistant numbers is because, that the ones testing it use different ways to measure distance. If we all had the same tools, then I think that you’d have your consistant results. With that said, we realize that you are all busy. There are people that try to help out as much as possible. A friend and I are going to make tools to try and test weapons. Maybe then tests from us may be more helpful. With that said:

Let my army grooooooow! lol

]]> By: julieanne rau http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1260 julieanne rau Fri, 02 May 2008 15:29:19 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1260 WOW, I think thats the most I have ever seen Esprite write. So with that said, I know he sees the importance of getting it right for the rest of us. Thanks Esprite. JAR WOW, I think thats the most I have ever seen Esprite write. So with that said, I know he sees the importance of getting it right for the rest of us. Thanks Esprite.

JAR

]]> By: Takuan http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1255 Takuan Fri, 02 May 2008 03:18:07 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1255 Yeah, I remember when I used to have a few hundred duels a week, now I'm lucky to get 10 or 20 in a "slow" week. There's definitely a level of understanding that's missing from not being able to spend a lot of time actually using the weapons under 'real world' conditions, but unless I forgo sleep *altogether* I just can't squeeze in the time to do it :( Yeah, I remember when I used to have a few hundred duels a week, now I’m lucky to get 10 or 20 in a “slow” week. There’s definitely a level of understanding that’s missing from not being able to spend a lot of time actually using the weapons under ‘real world’ conditions, but unless I forgo sleep *altogether* I just can’t squeeze in the time to do it :(

]]> By: Esprite Xavier http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1254 Esprite Xavier Fri, 02 May 2008 02:22:48 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1254 As mentioned earlier though Arch is going to be reworking the Nagi and this issue will be looked at. As mentioned earlier though Arch is going to be reworking the Nagi and this issue will be looked at.

]]> By: Esprite Xavier http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1253 Esprite Xavier Fri, 02 May 2008 02:17:23 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1253 I think the problem is the inconsistent results that people get. We work on the swords and provide support, and we try to listen to the bug reports people give us, but some of them tend to be confused about certain mechanics of the swords to say why something is broken. That's why we rely on our knowledge about how the swords work when making deductions about things. Really what is most important is when people like Robby provide real data for us to look at. We have a small team that splits their time between SL and real life, we cannot maintain development and duel at the level of some of the regulars, so having hard data helps alot when we can't always prioritize testing specific aspects of certain weapons. (the last thing I was able to test with arch was trying to track down exactly what was causing the matherror bugs to which we got some idea but needed further tests with linden feedback..which we haven't gotten much of, we thought it was possible kick was related as well in some ways.) I've asked Archanox about the range of the nagi when people asked about it and replied to those who had questions regarding this based on his feedback on what he programmed it to do. No one has ever provided data otherwise, and really this is the first time one of the devs tested it and found some real numbers so we can begin to look at what is effecting range exactly. When dealing with inconsistent results its hard to come to the same conclusion as others, we do test the weapons quite extensively even new features and have begun working with testers before making releases as well, mostly things with SL are getting more complicated than they used to be, and the scripts in the swords themselves are getting quite large and complicated as well. Hopefully with mono we're able to better consolidate the code to work properly. Robby I think is probably the most experienced when dealing with real bugs. We have Arch and I who are still students are are learning really and gaining experience being developers. I do think we have some ways to go in effectively communicating with the issues our users face. So I do apologize for confusion we have regarding problems people may have. However we do have a plan, and I hope you all continue to trust us with development of this system. I think we're all pretty dedicated to C:SI and we're all expanding what we know and our methods to further advance the depth of C:SI and to continue to keep things fun.(for example I'm now gonna be working in a mocap studio and have done a few captures that I'm trying to work into SL for C:SI.) I'm pretty sure we're pushing alot of SLs limits with this system so we're probably gonna be coming across alot of bugs that other people might not come across. So I hope you all don't get too annoyed with poking us on issues you find, and we appreciate those that can provide us with numbers showing bugs. As for the forums, if it doesn't work to post there its best to IM the dev of the weapon you own or even better leave a notecard. I know some of the devs don't like forums as a method for communication. (See the comments on the SL blog for the reason why :P) Though I do try to follow up with the other devs with important issues that get posted there. (sorry for the lame grammar!) I think the problem is the inconsistent results that people get. We work on the swords and provide support, and we try to listen to the bug reports people give us, but some of them tend to be confused about certain mechanics of the swords to say why something is broken.

That’s why we rely on our knowledge about how the swords work when making deductions about things. Really what is most important is when people like Robby provide real data for us to look at. We have a small team that splits their time between SL and real life, we cannot maintain development and duel at the level of some of the regulars, so having hard data helps alot when we can’t always prioritize testing specific aspects of certain weapons. (the last thing I was able to test with arch was trying to track down exactly what was causing the matherror bugs to which we got some idea but needed further tests with linden feedback..which we haven’t gotten much of, we thought it was possible kick was related as well in some ways.)

I’ve asked Archanox about the range of the nagi when people asked about it and replied to those who had questions regarding this based on his feedback on what he programmed it to do. No one has ever provided data otherwise, and really this is the first time one of the devs tested it and found some real numbers so we can begin to look at what is effecting range exactly.

When dealing with inconsistent results its hard to come to the same conclusion as others, we do test the weapons quite extensively even new features and have begun working with testers before making releases as well, mostly things with SL are getting more complicated than they used to be, and the scripts in the swords themselves are getting quite large and complicated as well. Hopefully with mono we’re able to better consolidate the code to work properly.

Robby I think is probably the most experienced when dealing with real bugs. We have Arch and I who are still students are are learning really and gaining experience being developers. I do think we have some ways to go in effectively communicating with the issues our users face. So I do apologize for confusion we have regarding problems people may have.

However we do have a plan, and I hope you all continue to trust us with development of this system. I think we’re all pretty dedicated to C:SI and we’re all expanding what we know and our methods to further advance the depth of C:SI and to continue to keep things fun.(for example I’m now gonna be working in a mocap studio and have done a few captures that I’m trying to work into SL for C:SI.) I’m pretty sure we’re pushing alot of SLs limits with this system so we’re probably gonna be coming across alot of bugs that other people might not come across.

So I hope you all don’t get too annoyed with poking us on issues you find, and we appreciate those that can provide us with numbers showing bugs.

As for the forums, if it doesn’t work to post there its best to IM the dev of the weapon you own or even better leave a notecard. I know some of the devs don’t like forums as a method for communication. (See the comments on the SL blog for the reason why :P) Though I do try to follow up with the other devs with important issues that get posted there.

(sorry for the lame grammar!)

]]> By: Kasumi Hashi http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1252 Kasumi Hashi Thu, 01 May 2008 23:41:38 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1252 This really is not meant to sound as testy as its likely to, but this has been obvious to regular users for 13 months now (I remember I and most others I talked with then noticed it in early April of 2007). Someone mentioned to me that Arch was in Meiji once explaining how its kick range is the same as the kats and people that think otherwise are confused... but it takes one spar to notice that you are getting kicked and can't slash back, and after a full year of that being the case in every spar there was never any doubt in anyone's mind that I talk to and who isn't brand new. Also, one moderately advanced skill set is knowing if you are in and out of range by the size of your opponent on your screen (so that you can run up to them *just* out of range and fool someone less skilled into thinking they can hit you, then tapping forward into range and countering once they do), so most people can tell without even having to slash back that they are being kicked out of counter range. This is another reason that Arch and Ayame should at least peak in on the forums (since Im pretty sure the longer range was discussed way back on the old forum), and realize that if someone uses C:SI an hour a day and they say X, and someone who wrote the code and never uses it (or uses it in isolation from real competition) says Y, I bet 9 times out of 10 X will be right. This really is not meant to sound as testy as its likely to, but this has been obvious to regular users for 13 months now (I remember I and most others I talked with then noticed it in early April of 2007). Someone mentioned to me that Arch was in Meiji once explaining how its kick range is the same as the kats and people that think otherwise are confused… but it takes one spar to notice that you are getting kicked and can’t slash back, and after a full year of that being the case in every spar there was never any doubt in anyone’s mind that I talk to and who isn’t brand new. Also, one moderately advanced skill set is knowing if you are in and out of range by the size of your opponent on your screen (so that you can run up to them *just* out of range and fool someone less skilled into thinking they can hit you, then tapping forward into range and countering once they do), so most people can tell without even having to slash back that they are being kicked out of counter range.

This is another reason that Arch and Ayame should at least peak in on the forums (since Im pretty sure the longer range was discussed way back on the old forum), and realize that if someone uses C:SI an hour a day and they say X, and someone who wrote the code and never uses it (or uses it in isolation from real competition) says Y, I bet 9 times out of 10 X will be right.

]]> By: Takuan http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1249 Takuan Thu, 01 May 2008 19:06:53 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1249 Ah, I remember seeing that now. Unfortunately, while it does show that more than one person has had the issue, there's not enough information there for me to try to guess at what the cause might be. Well, maybe, but not any solid guesses, at least. For instance, the code is the code and doesn't really change, so why should a newly-rezzed weapon be different? I haven't a clue, though I will continue to think about it and hope that more information can be provided by the users. Ah, I remember seeing that now. Unfortunately, while it does show that more than one person has had the issue, there’s not enough information there for me to try to guess at what the cause might be. Well, maybe, but not any solid guesses, at least.

For instance, the code is the code and doesn’t really change, so why should a newly-rezzed weapon be different? I haven’t a clue, though I will continue to think about it and hope that more information can be provided by the users.

]]> By: julieanne rau http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1248 julieanne rau Thu, 01 May 2008 19:03:54 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1248 BTW, later on in the posts she confirms that when she typed Katana, she meant Nagi. Should have added that in the first place. JulieAnne BTW, later on in the posts she confirms that when she typed Katana, she meant Nagi. Should have added that in the first place.

JulieAnne

]]> By: julieanne rau http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1247 julieanne rau Thu, 01 May 2008 18:53:51 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1247 Sure, here ya go Robby <blockquote><b>Carolin Gausman said...</b> Hi there! the last days I had a wierd bug. I had shorter range then other naginata fighter. i tried with a few ppl the range after i noticed it. we both stood in block. i kicked and didnt hit. then my opponent kicked and hit me. cuz of that i rezzed a new one out of box. 1 spar okay and next spar again. we tried again together the range thingy from above. next day i rezzed again new one out of box. same thing with the range. was shorter. =( after that i let me send a new box. rezzed the box, got the katana and still same ... in 1 spar i also had shorter range then a katana.... =( hope u guys can fix that too soon greetings </blockquote> Sure, here ya go Robby

Carolin Gausman said…

Hi there!

the last days I had a wierd bug. I had shorter range then other naginata fighter. i tried with a few ppl the range after i noticed it. we both stood in block. i kicked and didnt hit. then my opponent kicked and hit me.

cuz of that i rezzed a new one out of box. 1 spar okay and next spar again. we tried again together the range thingy from above.
next day i rezzed again new one out of box. same thing with the range. was shorter. =( after that i let me send a new box. rezzed the box, got the katana and still same …

in 1 spar i also had shorter range then a katana…. =( hope u guys can fix that too soon

greetings

]]> By: Malachi Rothschild http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1246 Malachi Rothschild Thu, 01 May 2008 17:54:50 +0000 http://www.daikonforge.com/webtab/2008/04/30/think-the-naginata-has-a-long-range-kick/#comment-1246 I don't remember who it was. It was a long time ago. But I will try to bug some of the people who I know use the nagi more frequently and encourage them to look at this thread and the forum discussion. I don’t remember who it was. It was a long time ago. But I will try to bug some of the people who I know use the nagi more frequently and encourage them to look at this thread and the forum discussion.

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