I intend to do a little more of an analysis/commentary on this issue tonight after work, but for now I want to throw a quick note in with some of the things that Esprite has said to me about this. He’s spoken with Tyrant, and had the moves demonstrated, and has some good points to make about it.
… So I spoke to tyrant and got him to show me those tricks people are talking about, it seems like there is alot of discussion about it … and we have people talking about whether or not its an exploit or something.
For me its something I have difficulty ruling on, policing people in general gridwide is not something I want to do, and the I guess legitmacy of using such techniques is something thats difficult as wel.
On one end, things like this to me are interesting, mainly because they are like new moves people discover for the weapons in such a way its akin to the jump slash, but then ya need to consider how such a thing effects gameplay and if it does so in a negative way.
And then the ultimate question of what could be done about it, if any, and if we deal with that do we have to deal with other “moves” as well, and what draws the line between them.
I think alot of people consider the issue of at what point would something like this be ok if it were allowed, “Think of the newbies!” comes to mind… But thats something we already have to deal with, people being more skilled than others, which is something we already have planned for being addressed in the new ranking system
Does this move or exploit and others like it, add to the color of our skill based system or does it impact it in a negative way? I’m uncertain really, infact I’d like to hear more people’s opinions on it.
It’s clearly not a black and white issue, and it would be good to get a dialog going about it. For me, my first reaction to it was utter frustration and irritation. On the other hand, the person that was doing that to me repeatedly was relying on the move too much - as many people with such “tricks” do - and I was able to win about half the time. So it’s not really a “supermove”, even if it is incredibly frustrating to fight someone who uses it. It’s just about as frustrating as fighting someone who constantly runs to heal, and makes me feel the same way about whether I want to continue dueling with them, but I’m still not 100% sure whether it should be officially ruled on.
I suspect - and this is my unofficial personal opinion only - that it will be much like space bar use in the sense that people will be warned about using it in official tournaments, and that many people will not choose to fight someone known to use these moves excessively, but that by and large it won’t change anything. The best fighters are not the best because of any single technique, but because of a holistic approach to the various techniques available.
I would love to encourage people to discuss this on the official C:SI forums, as this would give the problem more visibility to all the developers as well as several people who never read this blog.
Let us know what you think of this.
Well with these new moves/exploits or whatever ya’d think the clans would come up with some funny names for them, like LIGHTING LAG MONKEY ATTACK! or FLYING EAGLE STRIKES WITH PRIM.
Lightning Lag Monkey Attack FTW!!!!
“I suspect - and this is my unofficial personal opinion only - that it will be much like space bar use in the sense that people will be warned about using it in official tournaments, and that many people will not choose to fight someone known to use these moves excessively, but that by and large it won’t change anything. The best fighters are not the best because of any single technique, but because of a holistic approach to the various techniques available.
I would love to encourage people to discuss this on the official C:SI forums, as this would give the problem more visibility to all the developers as well as several people who never read this blog.” – Robby Raccon
http://forums.combatsi.com/viewtopic.php?t=202
Your wish is my command. However, I think that the discussion will fall short as most are unsure that they would like anyone to know they use this tactic or the spacebar for that matter. In a large part, most feel it is taboo (note Solaces comments about “crutch”, however he admits to using it). That tells me there is a sense of why not? As long as you don’t know! Your Blog is the only place I have seen where you say that tournaments do not allow spacebars so you would think it wouldn’t be practiced? However, if tournaments are far and few between (see my other posts) and your only sparring for fun, then who cares? I would like someone from C:SI to step up and say Yes or No to the spacebar and Lighting Lag Monkey Attack so we can stop second guessing whether or not to use them!
JulieAnne
Ah, I see the discussion on the official forums is well under way and I missed it! Sorry, JulieAnne. I’ll put in my two cents there. As to this blog being the only place that mentions spacebar not being allowed in tournaments, that may very well be true.
I posted that because I’ve seen people like gothio be told not to use it during Master’s Treasure tournaments (where it can be pretty obvious), and I’ve seen other people warned for it during other tournaments, but unless you’d been at a tournament where that happened you are not likely to have heard that.
And I guess that also points out that whether it is allowed is really up to the people holding the tournament. Shadow Samurai will be holding a tournament soon, and as the tournament sponsors they are certainly free to spell out the “rules of engagement” as they see fit, so it’s not even necessarily a universal rule.
I guess the bottom line for me, will be to start training in the use of spacebars and the LLMA (Lighting Lag Money Attach) starting tonight. It’s best that I start now as I’m getting the impression talking with people that, although it does not define a good fighter, it is something that is NOT forbidden to use. It good to have something like that in your back pocket as well. The trick is to not rely on it but to use it as one of the many tools you have for engagement.
Whether you intend to use it or not, and I can tell you that I personally don’t, it’s good to know the technique. Having an understanding of the enemy is *always* appropriate. And knowing how such things work probably has some benefit as well.